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Power Perspectives™ Podcast: Navigating Energy's Post-Election Crossroads in 2024 and Beyond (with Amy Myers Jaffe)

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In this episode, Amy Myers Jaffe, Director of the Energy, Climate Justice, and Sustainability Lab at NYU, joins the Power Perspectives Podcast in the wake of the November 2024 elections to discuss the most pressing issues shaping the energy landscape. With her expertise in energy geopolitics, climate risk, and sustainability, Amy offers invaluable insights into how utilities can adapt to evolving challenges while pursuing a more resilient and sustainable future.

Listen in as Amy explores:

  • The intersection of federal energy policies and state climate goals amidst political changes
  • Why small modular reactors (SMRs) may not be the universal solution some hope for
  • How digital solutions for demand management remain an underutilized opportunity
  • The role of supply chain resilience in ensuring reliable energy amid geopolitical tensions

Join host Jason Price and producer Matt Chester as they get a crash course into these critical topics with Amy Myers Jaffe. Whether you’re a utility executive, policymaker, or energy enthusiast, this episode provides actionable strategies for tackling today’s energy challenges and securing a sustainable future. 

Prefer to Read vs. Listening? Scroll Down to Read Transcript

Thanks to the sponsor of this episode of the Energy Central Power Perspectives Podcast: West Monroe

 

Key Links:

Energy's Digital Future: Harnessing Innovation for American Resilience and National Security by Amy Myers Jaffe

Five Ways to Disaster-Proof the Energy Grid by Amy Myers Jaffe: https://www.wsj.com/us-news/climate-environment/energy-grid-extreme-weather-power-outages-c77e97e2

Amy's Energy Central Profile: https://energycentral.com/member/profile/amy-jaffe

Ask a Question to Our Future Guests: Do you have a burning question for the utility executives and energy industry thought leaders that we feature each week on Power Perspectives? Leave us a message here for your chance to be featured in an upcoming episode: www.speakpipe.com/EnergyCentralPodcast 

 

TRANSCRIPT

Jason Price:

Welcome to another episode of the Energy Central Power Perspectives Podcast, where we dive into the most pressing challenges and advancements in the utility and energy sectors. Today, we're thrilled to have a renowned expert and thought leader in the world of energy, Amy Myers Jaffe. Amy is a globally recognized expert on the geopolitics of energy, climate risks, sustainability, and so much more. As a director of the Energy, Climate Justice, and Sustainability Lab at NYU, Amy is pioneering discussions on energy security, resilience, and the intersection of new technologies with environmental policy. I'm Jason Price, your host coming to you from New York City. And with me as always from Orlando, Florida, as Energy Central producer and community manager, Matt Chester. Matt, when we talk geopolitics and energy, what areas of focus tend to resonate most with our Energy Central community?

 

Matt Chester:

Yeah, Jason. So, while our Energy Central community, it's definitely focused largely on North America, both in terms of our membership and in the content, the world of energy and utilities today, it's, of course, interconnected internationally more than ever before. So, given that we're seeing regular conversations on the platform that look into the international and geopolitical lenses of energy, whether that's technology sharing, trade agreements, the international politics associated with critical minerals, global conferences and agreements for decarbonization targets and financing, and then even the national security angle of each of these topics. So, professionals in the energy sector these days, they don't have the luxury of thinking just in their localized, isolated manner, but this more geopolitical view really does permeate as a requirement now. And we're seeing that in the conversations on Energy Central.

 

Jason Price:

That's right, Matt. And I think any of our listeners who share that focus will be hooked by today's discussion. Before we dive into today's episode, I do want to thank West Monroe, our sponsor of today's show. Now, Amy Myers Jaffe really is an expert whose knowledge is wide as it is deep. Meaning, we'll have the opportunity to talk about all the headline topics top of mind these days. And that includes AI, SMRs, and how the heck is the utility sector going to find a way to meet the never-ending demand growth on the grid. But let's not get too deep without our guest. So, let's bring her in. Amy Myers Jaffe, welcome to the Energy Essential Power Perspectives Podcast.

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Jason, thanks for having me. I'm looking forward to our discussion today.

 

Jason Price:

As are we. Amy, I don't want to undersell your resume. Can you give our listeners a rundown of your history in the energy industry and your current post at NYU?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Well, Jason, I began my career actually as a energy journalist, writing about the oil industry. So, that put me into knowing the movers and the shakers pretty much all around the world. And from that, I moved to the university world, and started about geopolitics and energy policy. Now, at NYU, I'm much more focused on electricity innovation and markets, still with a geopolitical focus on electricity. I know a lot of your listeners don't think of electricity as being geopolitical, so we'll probably go down that rabbit hole a little bit together. But I've done some unusual things along the way. I was in California for a while, helping the state with its low carbon fuels policy. I served for a while as an advisor to the UC Regents Pension Fund, which is basically the largest pension and endowment fund in the country.

They were trying to develop a sustainable investing framework, help the chief investment officer with that. And then help them train people how to implement it and then writing books. So, you mentioned my book, Energy Digital Future. That was a major project done together with Columbia University's Center on Global Energy Policy. And I've written in the past a book about why we keep having repeated oil price crises. Anyway, that's a little bit about me.

 

Jason Price:

All right. Fantastic. And we're thrilled to have you here because we're just still digesting the outcome of the most recent election. So, everything is really timely and having you here is really timely. So, since we're going to have new leadership or returned leadership to the White House in a few months, we want to see and get your perspective on how you see things from an energy policy and overall climate policy perspective.

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Well, let me just say in terms of being an intellectual, I think that's like a negative buzzword today. So, let me just say I spend a lot of time with the same kind of executives that listen to the show. I spend a lot of time with industry, a lot of time with practitioners. And one of the things I know from doing that is that the kinds of things we talk about in sound bites in political speech-making are ones where when we start getting behind the curtain and we have to really think about how to reform the electricity system, say in the United States to get more stable energy and to get more affordable energy. I can tell you that I don't think that just eliminating environmental policies is going to lower the cost of electricity in the United States. So, let's talk about that for a minute.

I mean, I like the fact that J.D. Vance talked about the shortages in key equipment like transformers. That made me feel more confident that we're entering a new White House administration with people who understand the problems that we have in the sector. I believe that when you look at Biden policies and Trump policies, going back to 2016 and then looking forward, that our current administration, the Biden administration and Trump 1.0 and definitely Trump 2.0, everybody understands the importance of winning the race globally to be the leaders in artificial intelligence and everything that goes with that. And we could talk a little bit about the consequences of the AI world on military and weaponry and so forth. But really, most importantly, because AI is going to be so central to our national security, then having a stable and secure electricity grid becomes a top priority. And that is not a straightforward task as everybody in the industry knows.

We have to be thinking about not just the way we have political dialogue today about what is the winning form of generation. Because in my opinion, the answer to that question, quite frankly is location-specific. It's not just renewables versus some other dirtier fuel. It's really about the broad range of solutions. And that I've written a book. So, digital solutions, how and where we're going to use AI, what transmission technologies we should be seeking out and how would we implement them best, and what policy reform is needed? Do we need to change the way we do prices in this country? Is there a way to have data centers and cryptocurrency pay a higher wholesale price than residential low-income users? And how would we implement that? So, those are the questions that I think we actually need to grapple with. And I look forward to discussing more about that with you as the show rolls off.

 

Jason Price:

That's great. So, Amy, I want to ask you about the dynamics between the federal priorities, and of course, the state agendas on energy and climate goals. That's always an interesting dynamic, especially with Trump 1.0 and what we're anticipating on 2.0. So, I'd love to get your perspective on that. So, are we going to see the courts involved and the process gummed up or do you think we'll see the continued momentum at the state level like we saw in Trump 1.0? Can you talk about that?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

It's just pretty hard today, I think, to do anything without the courts getting involved when you're talking about any kind of infrastructure. So, I think that that's a communications challenge. I think when the president comes back into office, he needs to talk directly to the American people about why energy infrastructure is important to national security and how sometimes we have to look beyond a local impact. And I think it's a tough sell. That's problem number one. And then I think industry really needs to help policymakers understand what kind of technology is out there. When people come in to Congress, new Congress people and senators, and when we have a new administration, how many people are going to know what the word reconductoring means and what are we really saying? What kind of materials are out there? What should be R&D and first of a kind demonstrations? What is there that we really know works that we should be doing? And what is it that's blocking us from getting there? And what would it achieve in terms of more transmission and the right transmission and the stable transmission? And what's the role for federal dollars?

I've been a little bit critical of DOE over this past year. Because I get it, they've approved and funded a lot of great corridors, North Plains, Cross-Tie, Southline, Cimarron. But is that really where we have the bottlenecks that are being created by data centers? Because I would argue that a lot of those projects, though they have a lot of merit, didn't actually address the national security problems that we have. And so, I would hope that when the Trump administration comes in, they really sit down systematically with a map and say, "Does Constellation need any help? I mean, is ERCOT where it needs to be?"

And really look at places where we have a tremendous amount of data centers already and possible more growth. Arizona was one place, maybe that project made sense. But we really need to be analytical and we can't just be this money out the door because I know a congressman or money out the door because we're in a rush. I think there really needs to be a systematic national security deep dive on the whole grid nationally and where the best places are to spend federal dollars.

 

Jason Price:

All right. Well, that's interesting. So, let's talk about this a little bit further. You're basically giving a framework of what the incoming administration should be thinking about. Can you now prioritize? What would be on your top 10 list of priorities that the administration should be thinking about, especially as it relates to meeting growth and demand and growing load that we're seeing across the country?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

I just say transmission, transmission, transmission. And when I say transmission, by that I really don't mean just, like I said, are we having or not having national corridors? I really think we need to look at the whole range of technology and funding for that technology. How do we get utilities to spend the money to do more advanced materials or to use some of these newfangled digital solutions that can help them move away from standardized line rating to more dynamic systems, where we can better utilize the facilities we have? First of all, we need to rethink what authorities are we giving FERC and how do they implement them. That would be step two. And then in thinking about FERC, what needs to be done? I mean I know a lot of people are talking about small nuclear reactors and we can go down that rabbit hole later. But people talk about small nuclear reactors like we're going to build one next year and it's going to solve some problem we have for 2028.

That's not really going to happen. But you do have a lot of utilities experimenting with virtual power plant and other kind of battery systems. And again, do we have the regulatory guidance to facilitate that? And like you said, what's state, what's federal? Do we have coordination between state and federal? Are we swimming in opposite directions? One thing I would not like to see that we saw in Trump 1.0, I think we need to move away from viewing everything in a political way. So, suing the State of California for innovating would be a bad idea. I think we need to really think about where have we tried different kinds of solutions and where has it worked. And then what does FERC need to do to work with the states to get the regulatory settings we need to make those things effective.

 

Jason Price:

Amy, you talked about Constellation and you mentioned SMRs, and I want to ask you about that, because I know in our planning call you had some feelings about where you see SMRs in the whole mix. Can you take us through that? Give us your perspective on SMRs and why do you feel they may not be all encompassing solution for what we may need?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

So, my whole concern about SMRs is not actually with the technology itself. I think we have some interesting designs that are worth looking at. But my concern is really timeline. We have a problem. I mean at some point, advanced materials for chips and quantum computing might make the current problem look smaller. And that might be in the same timeframe that we can get a first of a kind demonstration on an SMR. So, we shouldn't be talking about those two things as if they're completely independent of each other. And we shouldn't talk about SMRs with this hype scale that, "Oh, we're going to solve this problem with SMRs," because there are other things we can do. Hydrogen, for example, as a storage medium could be a solution in some locations.

So, I like to ask the critical questions. What is the real timeline for high-assay low-enriched uranium, HALEU fuel? We're talking about HALEU fuel in 2030. Is that realistic? Number two, what designs has the NRC actually approved? Answer to that question is not many. And even for the one that's been through the whole process, which is NuScale, they haven't been through the whole process on the larger sizes. So, I got it. There's some others that are a little bit further along, like K-ROS. But in the end, that's the first step. The second step is to think about the other thing. Are all the proposed plants, do they all have operators? Do they all have waste plans? What do we actually know about the cost for first of a kind? Are we sure about those costs and how we think they're going to go? No one seems to talk about the fact that we're starting to go to encasing nuclear waste heavy metal containers, casks now, because we've run out of space in the water ponds.

So, there's just a lot of problems that we're glossing over by just saying SMRs like they're going to magically appear and all these other things I'm mentioning aren't an issue. And so, that's sort of my perspective is that I'd like to see the discussion on SMRs go down into the weeds and not be this sort of gloss over thing I'm saying. I think one of the things that I was sharing with someone who was actually with an SMR company, they were asking me what am I hearing in the finance world. And I said, "Well, in the finance world, people are looking at retired or aging coal plants that are on a really good site with really nice transmission, large-scale transmission. And could they buy that site under Trump, and keep the coal plant operating to have some cash flows, and then be positioned for when SMRs are kind of cleared up and they could commission one to come on their site?" So, they're not even talking about how they are going to finance SMRs per se right now. I mean, I'm not saying no one is, but it's a long journey.

 

Jason Price:

Yeah, absolutely. It's going to require a lot of regulation, a lot of clarity, a lot of finance. I mean just think of the supply chain, right? All the equipment that's going to be needed to supply and help run these things. You can't just go to local store or go on Amazon to buy a lot of the specialized equipment that's going to be needed. Amy, you've written a lot about energy and technology. In fact, your book, Energy's Digital Future, you dived into technology and the technology movement and how we've advanced to some degree, but maybe we're overselling or underselling some of the values. I want to ask you about, and I think it was one of your thesis statements, was around the untapped potential in using digital solutions for demand management. Can you share more about that opportunity or the way you see it and why do you feel it's under discussed compared with other technologies?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Well, let's unpack that because it is a big piece of what I think we could be doing. And remember, if I can shed some load over here, then I can keep my data center on. So, people don't understand what's already happened. When I mentioned, I'm sure even some of your listeners, I talk about virtual power plant, for example. So, some kind of combination of asking people to join in aggregated battery system and then donate part of their battery to the utility or to the VPP provider, like the Teslas or Sunruns, through some kind of software or contractual agreement. So, what's interesting to me about that is just thinking about what have we had that's a success recently when it comes to load problems from weather.

Because we're all talking about the load from data centers or some people are talking about electric cars, but it's unpopular to talk about the problems that are coming from extreme weather. But those are perhaps more daunted and still becomes a matter of national security. I mean, we don't want to have a national security event and we can't deal with it because we had bad weather. So, what are we talking about? So, I like to use the example of CAISO from 2022. I got heckled one time trying to speak about this at a major convention of electricity cooperatives from the, I guess Midwest and Southwest.

But then after I went through the actual statistics, everybody smartened up and then they asked me actually pertinent questions. So, CAISO in 2022 had a typical summer load of 30 megawatt. September '22, that surged based on the heat wave to 50 megawatts. So, you're talking about a sudden 60% increase. When I was speaking at this convention, I asked everybody to raise their hand if they thought they were prepared to cope with a sudden 60% increase in load. And of course, no one raised their hand. And I asked if any of them had done a 10-year forward weather forecast or whether they were all still doing forecasts based on historical weather. I mean, I don't know, there might've been like 800 to 1,000 people there. And rhetorically and then later in the reception, they all agreed no one was doing forward-looking load projections. So, that was again a problem.

But in the end, on September 6th, CAISO sent out these tweets telling you what to do. And I have to say I was in California at the time in a rented house. We got the messages because I'm still in the California system, because I lived for a while in California. And it told me what to turn off. And as a result of those flex alerts, they were able to shave 10% of load. On September 6th in particular, they shed 1,200 megawatts and there was no brown out. The costs were astronomical, though. Wholesale hit $1,200 per megawatt hour. That's versus the normal $100. The September average wasn't as bad, $450. But it was a lesson if we could come up with a system where we're paying people to turn off and doing other things so we don't have all this bidding in the market.

If we know we're doing it and it's prepared and the market's structured a certain way, then you might get less of a response in the wholesale price. And in the end, in 2022, batteries contributed 6% of energy supply during peak. Now, why is that significant? Because literally, I know it won't be the day that this podcast airs, but it is today, the day we're taping it. Today in ERCOT, batteries hit a record of 8% supply, and they stayed on and provided 2,000 megawatts of power for two hours. So, they were a critical buffer. And you don't hear people standing up and talking about, "Oh, let's do batteries." I mean I guess now that Elon Musk is cheerleader number one for Trump 2.0, maybe we'll hear more about it.

But it's not talked about the way people talk about reliability, and yet they're playing a big role and thinking concretely about what is the pricing that's needed to have those batteries play a real substantial part. And Elon Musk did a lot of reform work lobbying in Texas to be able to put his batteries at different segments of the electricity value chain. So, it's really an interesting thing to think through and we'd have to get the public there. But you have places like Vermont, where they have now a major state program and you have other states that are kind of looking at the same. We're doing a research project on the state of these aggregated battery projects and some demand management projects that don't involve batteries or solar.

And we counted up based on some other databases that people have put together and we verified there's over 125 projects now across the United States, which I don't think people understand how big it is. People think it's just Vermont or just PG&E. We're talking about 94 active projects. Some of them are community aggregations and some of it's Tesla. But you're starting to get some big players. Besides Green Mountain, and PG&E, and Hawaiian Electric, you've got Rocky Mountain, you've got Duke, you've got Eversource. So, we're moving forward with that and it has to be part of the mix. Just saying we're going to do SMRs in 10 years doesn't solve this year's problem. VPPs can be put in unbelievably quickly and they can be repaired in a storm unbelievably quickly. And so, we really need to give that some attention.

 

Jason Price:

Absolutely, it makes sense. The mix of energy sources and how we use it plus demand management is all going to need to play a role. Amy, if you don't mind, I want to go back to the geopolitical dimensions of our discussion. And you've written a lot about this. And I mentioned briefly about supply chain and I want to hear you talk about that, particularly components like transformers and other manufactured items that rely on rare earth metals. We're surrounded by global tensions everywhere, unfortunately. And this is playing a role in US policy, US sourcing, the manufacturing by America. You studied this as part of your research. Can you talk about that? Just give us an idea of what your perspective is on this, and just what should we be thinking about as we look at supply chain and supply chain resilience in the next administration?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

So, let me start with one basic fact. The fact is one of the first things that Russia bombed when it did its latest incursion into Ukraine was their factory for making transformers. And that resulted in a ripple effect, because that meant that United States and Europe had to supply... every time the Russians bombed energy infrastructure in Ukraine, the allies have to come up with more transformers and other basic equipment to be reinstalled in Ukraine. And we have to be thinking strategically about what pressure that puts on our own system when it comes to severe weather and other things that, when I'm talking both large that are system transformers and the little boxes on my street corner. So, the Congress has attempted several times to raise a bill to put transformer manufacturing inside the United States on par with some of the other manufacturing that we've given an assistance to, and they got knocked out of the IRA bill.

I'll be sarcastic for a minute. I hope this doesn't offend anybody, but the idea that we're given a subsidy to people to have an electric bicycle in the city, but we couldn't come up with the funding to help manufacture more transformers when that's a critical linchpin in keeping reliable electricity for our allies who are in war and for ourselves in our own country. That really irritates me. So, I think that's something we need to reconsider. And if you think about vulnerability. When I was living in California, we had this crazy thing. I had to go on TV and talk about it. So, I remember distinctly because some "people" went and used high-powered rifles to shoot transformers and it caused this big blackout in Northern California. And later, I mean, I don't know, I'm not in the intelligence community so I can't weigh in, but there was some discussion unconfirmed that maybe it was a terrorist attack.

And one of the clever things they did is they not only shot up these transformers, they knocked out 911. So, you couldn't even call and say you were in the dark. That's how they got away, because people who heard the explosion and the firing couldn't call 911 because 911 was turned off. So, we really need to think very seriously about are we engaged in the right manufacturing and the right stockpiling when it comes to energy supplies. I get how people in some parts of the country feel about their local commodity that's produced in their state. I lived 25 years in Texas, so I can understand that sentiment. But, and there's the but, the reality is that we know from say what happened to hospitals in Puerto, Rico or other places, that a company like Tesla can go in with a bunch of solar panels and some batteries, and put something back online at least temporarily for some power and usage within a week or two.

I mean, it doesn't take long to put those systems up. And it might not be a permanent solution, but it's a solution for critical operations. So, I actually wrote a piece in Foreign Affairs Magazine about how the Pentagon itself should be stockpiling solar panels and batteries for use in national emergencies or even in the war setting. And when we think about it, obviously, the Pentagon already stocked some basic metals, so they're probably on that. But thinking about what is it exactly that utilities should be stockpiling. I'm sure many utilities have a backlog of transformers and maybe because so many people are stockpiling transformers, that's why we have a global shortage in them. I mean, definitely.

But it's interesting, I heard an interview with someone from Hitachi where they were saying that we have it under control. We have these two new plants coming on in the United States, blah, blah, blah. And then three days later, I'm picking up the Financial Times newspaper and the chairman of Hitachi is saying there's a major problem globally. So, I don't know. I think, again, I'm not an expert enough, I just know that it's a problem because of the Ukraine war. And if we don't settle that war and we have continued warfare in other locations like the Middle East, then that's something that puts things under pressure.

And the other thing just to sort of highlight to your listeners, because it's probably not on their radar screen, no pun intended, is that Europe has a connected grid across many, many countries, and with some interesting connections to North Africa and elsewhere. But one of the things that's sort of a function of history that is about to change is that the countries of Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia were originally in what's called the BRELL system, which is a vestige of the former Soviet Union. So, they are literally connected to Russia's grid. And they have to give the Russians six months notice to stop being connected to BRELL and to fully convert to the SUN European system. And when the Ukrainians did that, they got attacked.

Now, I'm not saying that that means that the Baltics are going to get attacked, but it's a stressful situation. The Russians have interfered some with the construction of undersea pipelines to other European countries. And it's a tense situation. And again, it's having us think geopolitically about grids in Europe and grids elsewhere. And what is the US role in defending our allies' electricity systems? Is that material? Is that assistance with cyber protection? Do we have enough cyber protection in this country to make sure that we can have a deterrent effect because we don't have to worry about being attacked back? I don't think we've really thought seriously enough about that question, frankly.

 

Jason Price:

All right. So, Amy, you've taken us across the world to a whole inventory of challenges and questions that are going to face the next administration. But why don't we take a pause there for a moment, let our listeners take a deep breath. And we're going to shift now to what we call the lightning round, where, Amy, we get an opportunity to learn a little bit more about you, person, rather than you the professional. So, we're going to ask you a series of questions. We ask you to keep your response to one word or phrase. And are you ready?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

I am frightened, but ready. Okay, go ahead.

 

Jason Price:

All right. Nothing to be afraid of. What's your guilty pleasure snack?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Levain chocolate chip cookies. Love it.

 

Jason Price:

Those are good. What do you think you'd be doing for a career if you didn't end up in energy?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Well, I started out planning to be an international diplomat with the State Department. So, maybe if my parents had not refused to give me more money to continue my studies in Arabic and Egypt, I might actually still be a diplomat.

 

Jason Price:

Is there any specific book that's had the greatest impact to your perspective in this field?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Hats off to Matt Rogers and Stefan Heck. I love their book, Resource Revolution. And it got me really thinking about the role of technology innovation in the future. And very influential.

 

Jason Price:

Who are your role models?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Okay. First boss, someone most listeners never heard of. David Mizrahi was a professional Middle East expert. He had a specialty newsletter. And he taught me that when you get a critique from someone who might know less than you, always answer with a question first. Number two, James Baker, who I serve with under his institute in Houston at Rice University, Mr. Baker taught me, I think my most important life lesson, is that don't respond until you've had time to think through your strategy. Number three, which is kind of a recent inspiration again, because there's a Netflix special about her. I like, for women, Martha Stewart. And you're saying, "Well, that sounds crazy, she's baking cookies." But no, my love of chocolate chip cookies not withstanding. Do not make apologies for who you are. That is a motto and that is why I like her.

 

Jason Price:

We're collecting lightning round questions from past podcast guests to ask future guests. So, we have David Schleicher of NOVEC, recently challenged a future guests with the following question. Just to remind you, if you're not familiar with NOVEC, it's Data Center Alley in Northern Virginia. So, he asks, "What have you done to pass on the legacy of your knowledge and your experience in this most vital industry to the next generation of leaders," Amy?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Well, I will tell you the great thing about being a university professor is that it's your job to pass on your legacy. Hats off, you know who you are. I could name a few names if you want me to. My students are my legacy. And I have some very successful students in our field that we're talking about today, some of whom some of you may have heard of. So, they are my legacy. You know who you are. Should I mention some? I don't know. Maybe I shouldn't mention specific students. I have some really famous students.

 

Jason Price:

Now it's your turn. What lightning wrong question do you want to challenge a future guest to answer? And it can be topical and related to energy, or it can be an off the wall question.

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

I would have them answer, what would you tell your 22-year-old self about building a career in energy?

 

Jason Price:

Nice. And lastly, what are you most motivated by?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Well, I'm motivated by the younger generation. I like their first principles thinking. And I think that to solve many of the problems that we have going forward, that it's going to require a different way of thinking about the problem and not our typical way of coming up with small, incremental solutions. We really need to be able to think through new ways of solving the same problem with different kinds of technology and different kinds of ways of thinking about society.

 

Jason Price:

Well, those are sound words. And Amy, since you performed so beautifully in the lightning round, we want to give you the last word for today. So, knowing that you have decision makers, and executives in the power sector and key leaders at utilities listening in, what do you hope is the resounding lasting message they take away from our conversation today?

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Be open to thinking through what you need to use new technologies in a way that is, in your opinion, safe enough. Because to just say that these technologies are too experimental or too first of a kind or I can't try that, reliability is the most important thing, is not going to be good enough for the challenges we face. And also, if we're facing global competitors, China and others, who are going to use these technologies, whether we're going to use them or not. So, what do you need to make you comfortable to innovate?

 

Jason Price:

Excellent. And a lot of what you're talking about here is also in your most recent book, so we'll make sure we'll have that book title in the show notes for anyone who wants to read up more. So, Amy, I want to thank you very much for being a great sport on the show today. You've answered all the questions we've thrown at you. You've taken us across the world. So, Amy, again, thank you for joining us in today's episode of the podcast.

 

Amy Myers Jaffe:

Jason, thanks for having me.

 

Jason Price:

Oh, you bet. You can always reach Amy through the platform, the Energy Central platform, where she welcomes your questions and comments. And we also want to give a shout out of thanks to the podcast sponsors that made today's episode possible. Thanks to West Monroe. West Monroe is the leading partner for the nation's largest electric, gas and water utilities, working together to drive grid modernization, clean energy, and workforce transformation. West Monroe's comprehensive services are designed to support utilities in advancing their digital transformation, building resilient operations, securing federal funding, and providing regulatory advisory support.

With a multidisciplinary team of experts, West Monroe offers a holistic approach that addresses the challenges of the grid today and provides innovative solutions for a sustainable future. Once again, I'm your host, Jason Price. Plug in and stay fully charged in the discussion by hopping into the community at energycentral.com. And we'll see you next time at the Energy Central Power Perspectives Podcast.

 

About Energy Central Podcasts

The ‘Energy Central Power Perspectives™ Podcast’ features conversations with thought leaders in the utility sector. At least twice monthly, we connect with an Energy Central Power Industry Network community member to discuss compelling topics that impact professionals who work in the power industry. Some podcasts may be a continuation of thought-provoking posts or discussions started in the community or with an industry leader that is interested in sharing their expertise and doing a deeper dive into hot topics or issues relevant to the industry.

The ‘Energy Central Power Perspectives™ Podcast’ is the premiere podcast series from Energy Central, a Power Industry Network of Communities built specifically for professionals in the electric power industry and a place where professionals can share, learn, and connect in a collaborative environment. Supported by leading industry organizations, our mission is to help global power industry professionals work better. Since 1995, we’ve been a trusted news and information source for professionals working in the power industry, and today our managed communities are a place for lively discussions, debates, and analysis to take place. If you’re not yet a member, visit www.EnergyCentral.com to register for free and join over 200,000 of your peers working in the power industry.

The Energy Central Power Perspectives™ Podcast is hosted by Jason Price, Community Ambassador of Energy Central. Jason is a Business Development Executive at West Monroe, working in the East Coast Energy and Utilities Group. Jason is joined in the podcast booth by the producer of the podcast, Matt Chester, who is also the Community Manager of Energy Central and energy analyst/independent consultant in energy policy, markets, and technology.  

If you want to be a guest on a future episode of the Energy Central Power Perspectives™ Podcast, let us know! We’ll be pulling guests from our community members who submit engaging content that gets our community talking, and perhaps that next guest will be you! Likewise, if you see an article submitted by a fellow Energy Central community member that you’d like to see broken down in more detail in a conversation, feel free to send us a note to nominate them.  For more information, contact us at [email protected]. Podcast interviews are free for Expert Members and professionals who work for a utility.  We have package offers available for solution providers and vendors. 

Happy listening, and stay tuned for our next episode! Like what you hear, have a suggestion for future episodes, or a question for our guest? Leave a note in the comments below.

All new episodes of the Energy Central Power Perspectives™ Podcast will be posted to the relevant Energy Central community group, but you can also subscribe to the podcast at all the major podcast outlets, including: